he 2nd picture shows a Tokamak. And I understand that technology has been discontinued. It was a dead end. That's not the way to build a nuclear fusion reactor.
jediakyrol26 · 1d
@adrianmantsch83 @adrianmantsch83 tokomak design has been superseded by the hypothetically more reliable but less powerful Stellarator...but is still being researched. there are at l three major tokamaks being worked on currently...ITER, DEMO, and CFETR.
silverplan17134 · 1d
Hydrogen is flammable
Hence replaced in balloons
Hence dangerous
criacher62 · 13h
@silverplan17 yes, like oil and natural gases aren't flammable? They need to be, to generate energy. That's the whole . Also, hydrogen tanks for cars are safer than normal tanks.
gilradir10 · 16h
While I don't disagree in principle with the potential uses of hydrogen, you need to temper your expectations.
The plasma engine actually has nothing to do with Hydrogen since it would use Argon as fuel. It's already working in labs, however there are a couple of problems with using it to power spacecraft. The main advantage is the very high specific thrust, which is more than ten times that of conventional chemical rockets (afaik), which reduces the amount of fuel you'd have to carry with you. But it has a very low thrust of just 5N at a power of 200kW. Even the ISS doesn't have that much power available. Furthermore it has an overall efficency of ~60% and a large part of the remaining power would probably converted to heat, which is an enourmous problem in space.
So far the most promising application seems to be as a thruster for altitude control on the ISS, by trickle-charging batteries und periodically pulsing the engine.
gilradir9 · 15h
@gilradir The tokamak fusion reacter is also plausible, but sadly considerably further out of our reach technologywise.
I think the one you're referring to is the ITER and while they plan to switch it on in 2022, the goals are actually to first achieve deuterium-trtium fusion for extended periods of time and second to also manage fusion reactions that emit more energy than is necessary to keep it going. As far as I know, ITER has no way to convert the energy emitted by the reaction to electrical power.
Even if they did, your 100MW figure is rather minute. Modern coal power plants usually generate about 1GW.
The Toyota car almost certainly uses a power cell, which have been around for ages. They convert hydrogen and oxygen to water and directly produce electrical power. The problem is that you get _far_ less energy from this reaction than is necessary to split water in its components.
tymuszbbb46 · 1d
the problem tho is: where to get hydrogen? atm, it's generated from water, using electicity to split the molecule. the electricity usually comes from conventional fossil fuels.
although it's more efficient to have a giant fossil-fuel powerstation than a lot of small engines, it's still not green.
kill_furries01 · 26m
@tymuszbbb Chlamydomonas reinhardtii is an algae which can produce hydrogen
regonas4 · 17h
As a scientists, i can safely assure you than hydrogen cars will never be a thing.
Too many technical flaws.
mayl02 · 14h
@regonas "scientists". What does that mean ?
I can safely assure you that you should never say never, has you don't know what discover we will do in the future.
a_echta_steiraPro3 · 1d
Hydrogen is Hydrogen
haveltherock883 · 18h
@a_echta_steira oxygen is oxygen
yroby3 · 18h
Ye but splitting H2 requires electricity... Hurr durr energy isn't created out of nothing
bitterleaf17h
@ojakokko Where do you get H2 molecules from? This is not a natural form of Hydrogen and would be very unstable.. and first of all WHY? It isn't even mentioned anywhere here
randomtrollface4 · 14h
What about formic acid powered cars? A dutch university is testing this. If I remember correctly the formic acid wouldn't need high pressure tanks, but it can be converted to hydrogen in the car, which can be used as fuel for the engine.
tucnakpinguOP · 2 · 14h
@randomtrollface sounds interesting
luciel08111 · 18h
Nuclear powered car? The dream car for terrorist!
ojakokko5 · 18h
@luciel0811 Fuel cells have nothing to do with nuclear power. They burn the H2 and turn it to electricity (i'm not going to waste my time explaining the tech, noting that you think it's nuclear it would be pretty useless). The nuclear powered car was a concept by Ford (i don't remember the name) which was abandoned before prototypes were built.
publ134814h
For God's sake, it is not because your car is powered with electricity that it is green. Do you know how electricity is produced ?!
tucnakpinguOP · 2 · 14h
@publ1348 with a nuclear power... and nuclear power is greener than a solar or coal power plant
o__shit__waddupPro9h
"Using hydrogen isotopes or hydrogen itself" lol isotopes are the different neutronic variants of an element. E.g. There's hydrogen that has no neutrons, one( deuterium), or two (tritium).
o__shit__waddupPro9h
@o__shit__waddup the same principle applies to all elements... That's why you'll hear things such as Uranium 238, which simply means that this strand of uranium has an atomic mass of 238amu. Uranium 239 will simply be uranium 238+one neutron.
felixwot13h
Simply because a physics, you cannot miniaturize a fusion reactor. The high energy neutrons need think sheets of lead and concrete to be stopped. And even then, I wouldn't be all to comfortable getting within car distance of one!
Making a reactor smaller does not been you don't get high energy neutrons. You still need as Mich shielding. Not to mention all the material needed to withstand the heat and pressure.
Besides, it isn't just hydrogen you fuse, its highly radioactive isotopes of hydrogen. Not very safe.
felixwot13h
@felixwot the hydrogen fuel cells used in cars (I hesitate to call them reactors) do not fuse hydrogen. It reacts it with oxygen instead. You still need to produce the hydrogen in the first place. Think of hydrogen fuel cells are large capacity batteries with average efficiency.
catdolf_hitler18h
But how about G-force? I mean, if the ship is going that fast, the crew probably won't survive, and even the ship may burn down because of the friction caused by the ship and the air around it. I'm not really sure if they have something that will solve that or not, so captains, do your thing.
bottrop15h
@catdolf_hitler isnt gforce gravity related?
mustafashams01 · 14h
Doesn't nuclear fusion cause a lot of radiation though, Which is why you need a bunch of concrete and lead around that one fusion reactor in Europe? I don't think that can be implemented into a rocket or car. A generator yes, but a car, no.
tucnakpinguOP · 14h
@mustafashams0 i said hydrogen car not a fusion car different type of reaction
ETENEM1 · 15h
A question that bits me.
I am not a person who thinks world is flat butt.
Can someone explain how a spacecraft moves in space where is in full vacuum and no friction exists. How can there be a thrust in vacuum?
jonathanantonic4 · 15h
@ETENEM for every action there is alwais an equal and opposite reaction meaning that the energy that you use to push the gasses out of the rocket engine pushes the engine and thus the spacecraft in the opposite direction.
humpygrumpy11h
So you just heat it up to "many millions of degrees Kelvin", just like that? Wow, just wondering how any material can withstand this temperatures.... and where are you taking the energy for this? And the hydrogen fusion reactor: Where do you take the hydrogen from??? Yeah, that's right, you produce it out of water. And what do you need to seperate the bonds? Energy. And most of the energy is still coming from coal-fired and nuclear power plants. So that's not very sustainable (yet).
tucnakpinguOP · 1 · 8h
@humpygrumpy thats why i said future :)
kiwi_is_sad11h
Actually its imposible to create Fission plants.
Whe know that the sun does it, but whe dont got any material that dont melt with the temperatures produced.
kiwi_is_sad11h
@kiwi_is_sad sry, whe got fission plants.
I mean fusion*
invisgnartzPro14h
Do you know how much energy it takes to make hydrogen?
tucnakpinguOP · 14h
@invisgnartz less than a fusion reactor consumes
b0gglebrain1 · 16h
No, the future is orange
tucnakpinguOP · 1 · 16h
@b0gglebrain interesting theory you deserve oscar
bcoolidge2 · 17h
So you're telling us that, this Toyota can go from Earth to Mars within 6 months? It's amazing!
syamimmusa199h
@bcoolidge 29 days
gabrielautefag1 · 15h
Fusion reactor will not be operational in 2022. It was supposed to be available but it is more complex than initially planned. NIt will not work anytime soon. Maybe in 2080 it will be operational...
mayl02 · 14h
@gabrielautefag The Stellarator W 7-X has succesfully passed his first test phase, and is uprading to prepare phase 2. This upgrade was planned for september, so that mean we are 3 months ahead.
For me, actually, Germany is winning the fusion's race.
utkarsh7x7x71 · 16h
what if oil corporation around the world use their money and power to curb these ideas so that they don't run out of business and they are the reason we still haven't moved on to clean energy??....cos when they can deny millions of tons of oil spills just like that this will be a small thing for them....moreover so many major economies run on oil and they would fight till death to save themselves
tucnakpinguOP · 16h
@utkarsh7x7x7 becouse oil can be used to make plastic
finneraneoin8h
Hydrogen is more damaging for the environment because it's nearly always attached to something and separating it takes a lot of energy
tucnakpinguOP · 8h
@finneraneoin have you ever heard of energy from fusion and pressure tank for keeping hydrogen inside?
gingerbreadtig9h
you need to much energy to create hydrogen.
tucnakpinguOP · 8h
@gingerbreadtig have you ever heard how much energy can efficient (future) fusion reactor can generate energy?
laro750010h
Potato was not needed
tucnakpinguOP · 10h
@laro7500 sorry, i was afraid of haters saying no potato
pokketomonsutaa11h
I smell bullshit here. Fusion is nowhere close to be being a viable source of energy yet.
sage2418h
@pokketomonsutaa Japan, France and even companies like Lockheed Martin have been pouring funds into making it viable
grannyfukcer12h
Fusion reactirs are still impossible. Give it a few centuries and it'll be good
sage2418h
@grannyfukcer You used a double negative
dem_slaks13h
@sotha42 lol hydrogen doesn't fix anything. The only really viable way to get hydrogen is from hydrocarbons that's why big oil and car companies are trying to push it, it keeps the same strangle hold. Electrolysis is just silly using energy to split water to use as energy and converted back to water how is that sustainable? I believe it's only holding us back and I really do feel sorry for Cali.
sage2418h
@dem_slaks Electrolysis is silly? What do you mean by that? Shall I name the renewable energy sources capable of generating enough energy to split water or do you want to Google them?
tim432114h
Hydrogen is good fuel, but it is highly explosive once in your gas tank. This means that in case of a collapse the whole car will explode with one tiny spark.
tim432114h
@tim4321 boom.
rheav17h
Do you guys know that the water "generated", as the post says, is water vapor? That is really really worse than co2 to the Green house effect?
schweinezombie12h
@rheav It's not worse than CO2. Water vapor will always be in the atmosphere and if you add more, more will condense. Water vapor mainly plays a role as a feedback gas, meaning that the warmer the earth is, the more water vapor will get into the atmosphere. Hydrogen powered cars will have no effect on the amount of water vapor in the atmosphere.
bazingayPro17h
My Gfs dad has the first hydrogen powered car in switzerland, so far theres only 1 gas station. But i really believe this is the future since electric cars produce enormous waste through their battery
bottrop14h
@bazingay those hydro cars have batteries that store (excess) energy
superody6718h
Hey man, you lost me at "toyota"
ojakokko18h
@superody67 Sales for Toyota Mirai began last year. Are you oissed when Toyota happens to be a couple years ahead of your loved german carmakers? (According to current plans they will get a FCV in 2018)
windtiger004Pro1d
You could have used a Hyundai IX35 fuel cell instead of this shitty Toyota
ojakokko18h
@windtiger004 No. He shouldn't have used the Toyota FCV Concept indeed nor you ix35. He should've used Toyota Mirai, which is the first (sales began last year) truly mass produced (only 500 of your Huyndais were built) FCV.
tymuszbbb1d
which will only make the problem bigger: we get energy from space and put it on earth, causing the earth to warm up even more...
tucnakpinguOP · 1d
@tymuszbbb why transfer it to earth? you can use the energy directly in space
sekai_no_hebi1 · 6h
As i know the magnets always melt after a time and thaths why they cant made fusion reaktors ..
rjluxe1 · 6h
I wanna see that car explode.
crnivranac1 · 16h
hey... sry 4 a long comment
mekcmde1 · 17h
Potato also has Hydrogen. In the carbohydrates.
foxdonut501 · 17h
No, electric cars are the future.
zeromickenzoPro1 · 18h
Is that potato made from hydrogen?
tegarh2 · 1d
I hope this comment go on HOT section
sansemato101 · 18h
I think one of the reasons for people being so reluctant to develop hydrogen technologies is their possible destructive power.
Martinspirea moment ago
Honda started using hydrogen cars long before Toyota was doing it
mistergeof1m
There's one problem with this... Driving around a hydrogen Bomb is a bit of a hazard
kingcrispwtf1m
Top Gear showed us this years ago,
armykcz2m
Hydrogen is useless as storing mechanism of energy. Batteries are much better (more efficient, bigger lifetime,...)
srdiego993m
Good luck with crashes, Hydrogen is way more flammable than gasoline. Crashes will be twice as deadly
dronecloud4m
Regarding fusion reactors. I have hope, but I'll believe them when I see them. It's been at least 3 decades of "just 5 more years"..
fockoffmoit5m
Rare
skyers34m
Fuck prius, get Supra
xsoundwave5645m
jayroon012h
What? Since when do we have the technology to create and contain hydrogen fusion? And when the fuck did we figure out how to make a hydrogen reactor fit in a car!?
wijkingggwp3h
Vasimir didn't die for nothing!
skich3h
So... much... bullshit...
matmunirss4h
Not hydrogen potato. Im disaped
pastorjoao5h
It's
pastorjoao5h
I don't think is long enough to put a potato in the end
fritz0303945h
Toyota mirai? (Mirai=future in japanese)
evilbassturd6h
Remember the Hindenburg
realorgasm6h
I have heard about this technology 8 years ago.
fritzoune6h
it exists for more than 10 years now. guess who does not want us to use this ? governments ! too hard to tax.
tannielmaja7h
I don't accept your apology
eyemons8h
We are at least 50 years away from an industrially feasible fusion reactor, and it will not work with Hydrogen, so I call bullshit on this post.
rel_graffiti18h
Hydrogen engines are way more likely to go caboom.
niceguy228h
Did you know that water vapour is technically a green house "gas"
mahaca019h
Deuterium
thetruthm9h
No thanks I'll keep my V8
superradada10h
Ariane use hydrogen since 60 years
babuuun_doge10h
When you bump a speed bump.... ka boom !!!
eternalkuuseki10h
Car is going to be a racecar, i know it
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